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#31. Posted:
Philosophy
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I suppose I can be swayed to the view that being in a coma may be better than being in what we would consider reality.

Then again, like Theo has said, if you were to become conscious within your dream state you would realize that nothing in the dream is real including people. You would realize you are talking to what would essentially be robots.

This is where it all comes down to the individual state of mind that a person has. If you enjoy and can stand having that knowledge, then yes, I guess it would be better. On the other hand, having that knowledge could make you feel isolated and alone, which drives most people insane.

So I agree, but I also disagree.
#32. Posted:
Daedrism
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Super mega ultra Mindf*ck below:

Morgsboi, you may be interested to know, assuming you don't already, the views of Socrates and Descartes on the subject of Dreams.

This goes off topic slightly from your original question, but considering my last post on this topic already went off on a tangent, I don't see any harm in doing it again.

Socrates believed in something called a 'Daemonion', which was essentially a divine inner voice which could only be accessed or heard within the dream state.
Thomas Aquinas later backed this up, but instead of simply a divine inner voice, he stated that it was the voice of God, but that we should not listen to it, as it may be the voice of a demon, attempting to trick you into sin.
Moving back to Socrates and i'm going to claw at scraps right now trying to fit this with the topic, perhaps the voice, which has, after centuries of scrutiny been reverted back down to human intuition is the only thing that stops the dream state from becoming our reality?

Moving swiftly onto Rene Descartes, author of the famous philosophical phrase, 'I think therefore I am', disagreed with Socrates and instead stated that empirically, it is impossible to differentiate between the dream state and reality.

This fits nicely with the theory that we could all be in a coma right now.
Without the voice or intuition guiding us, we would be aware and unaware at the same time if Descartes is correct.

I apologize if this is a little hard to understand, but you are intelligent and educated on the subject, so I doubt you will have any trouble.

Edit:

Why stop at 2?

German Philosopher 'Kant' suggested that there are two types of worlds, Noumenal world, how things actually were independent of our perceptions of them [dreams] and the Phenomenal world, how we perceive the world around us.
However, Kant also stated that there was no way to travel between the two.
But, there was an American Philosopher called William James, he was also a psychologist and he moved Kant's theory up a level, stating that when we were in a dream state it was reality because that's where our thoughts were.
This is an extension of the theory that nothing exists until you perceive it. His reasoning was that if you cannot perceive anything real while you are dreaming, then where are you?
You can't be nowhere, otherwise you would die, so he stated that a dream was the bodies way of providing somewhere to exist for the duration of time you are asleep.
What if, the first time you fall asleep, the body is unable to begin perceiving the phenomenal world again so you are stuck in the false reality that your mind has created for you.

Kant also suggested that if one were able to travel between the two worlds, that person would be gifted or given prophetic visions because the Phenomenal world would run parallel to, but not equal with the Noumenal world.
Perhaps Nostradamus and other prophets had the ability to switch back and forth between these worlds?


Great post, but there are a couple more you could mention, Theo.

Take for instance Avicenna. He believed that during sleep all souls would travel to a 'Supernal' world, as he called it. In this place, the soul would be separated from the body and harbored with all of the other souls, in order to prevent demonic possession.

How could you forget Al Ghazali?
He was the first to ever connect dreams with the possibility of higher reality or dimensions activated by entering or deactivated by exiting a dream state, as they demonstrate both the fallibility of reliance on sense perception.


I was considering adding Al-Ghazali, but his theory doesn't seem to fit with this topic.

I agree though, Al-Ghazali was very much a pioneer in the higher reality/dimension field.
You should post your opinion on the whole topic, much more qualified than most to speak on the subject and not just because of your name...


I suppose I can be swayed to the view that being in a coma may be better than being in what we would consider reality.

Then again, like Theo has said, if you were to become conscious within your dream state you would realize that nothing in the dream is real including people. You would realize you are talking to what would essentially be robots.

This is where it all comes down to the individual state of mind that a person has. If you enjoy and can stand having that knowledge, then yes, I guess it would be better. On the other hand, having that knowledge could make you feel isolated and alone, which drives most people insane.

So I agree, but I also disagree.


You two should write a book.
#33. Posted:
Human
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in a coma you're just dreaming. you have no worries or fears... so yes, in a macabre sick way yes it is
a bit like the matrix red or blue pill
#34. Posted:
UK_cHaDd3rZ
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Sith wrote Well, in order to assume control you would first need to realize you are in a dream. This would be near impossible, in the first place.
But, as soon as you did that, you wouldn't be able to accept what is now your reality as a fake reality so it would be a complete illusion that you would unconsciously create.

Then, perhaps you would somehow achieve a state of enlightenment in which you break free from the Illusion, you break through the metaphorical 4th wall which would take you back to not accepting the fake reality?

Perhaps this would be when you wake up?

We could all be in a coma right now...?

you wouldn't realize you were in a coma so it would just be like having a dream and when you realize your actually dreaming from hearing people in the physical world talking and noises you would go lucid abit. but if your not to good at lucid dreaming and maintaining control of your subconscious you would loose it again and it would turn into a normal dream where you don't remember much just faded images. 5 years in a coma would be like 5 minutes for somebody that isn't good at lucid dreaming. 5 years in a coma could be anything for a good lucid dreamer as he would realize time was passing instead of a normal dream where you don't realize time exists... if we were all dreaming now then our 80 years of life could be 8 minutes in a world that we may wake up in...
best thing to do would ask somebody that's been in a coma...
#35. Posted:
morgsboi
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UK_cHaDd3rZ wrote
Sith wrote Well, in order to assume control you would first need to realize you are in a dream. This would be near impossible, in the first place.
But, as soon as you did that, you wouldn't be able to accept what is now your reality as a fake reality so it would be a complete illusion that you would unconsciously create.

Then, perhaps you would somehow achieve a state of enlightenment in which you break free from the Illusion, you break through the metaphorical 4th wall which would take you back to not accepting the fake reality?

Perhaps this would be when you wake up?

We could all be in a coma right now...?

you wouldn't realize you were in a coma so it would just be like having a dream and when you realize your actually dreaming from hearing people in the physical world talking and noises you would go lucid abit. but if your not to good at lucid dreaming and maintaining control of your subconscious you would loose it again and it would turn into a normal dream where you don't remember much just faded images. 5 years in a coma would be like 5 minutes for somebody that isn't good at lucid dreaming. 5 years in a coma could be anything for a good lucid dreamer as he would realize time was passing instead of a normal dream where you don't realize time exists... if we were all dreaming now then our 80 years of life could be 8 minutes in a world that we may wake up in...
best thing to do would ask somebody that's been in a coma...

Perhaps people have been in a coma and known they're in a coma, but when they woke up, they forgot that they knew. It's like when you wake up and forget a dream.

You know, an interesting thing that I've noticed happens to me is I'm dreaming, then I wake up, but I want to continue the dream, so I do. Then when I am consciously continuing the dream and something distracts me, I completely forget it and it is gone without a trace. No matter how hard I try to remember, or even do something else and hope it pops up in the back of my mind, I cannot remember it. Doesn't always happen but I thought I would share it.
#36. Posted:
MOAB
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Yes defiantly is............
#37. Posted:
Blueberry-_-
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I was in a coma for 1week but to me it felt like a normal sleep u don't want to be in one customers they put pipes in you bits so you can pee
#38. Posted:
ExoticWolfs
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Being in a coma is like your own world. Anything you grant could happen. You wouldn't know you would be in a coma either, till you do get back to reality. Thats how I see it.
#39. Posted:
xXKonataXx
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To be able to control it which i guess is like a lucid dream
#40. Posted:
ExoticWolfs
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EzGxSKILLZ wrote I was in a coma for 1week but to me it felt like a normal sleep u don't want to be in one customers they put pipes in you bits so you can pee


Maybe when you woke up you didn't remember anything. Maybe that;s what happens. Just like sometimes you don't remember your dreams.
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